Probably not going to happen, but how bad would it be for Tyler’s ego if his parents catch Zodon wandering around using Tyler’s DNA, and they assume Tyler somehow got super-genius powers that included physically transforming him?
Toby: “They already registered him/you as ‘Mental Powers’!”
Tyler: “This whole thing is mental!”
I think Ron is more saying that he has excellent eye-sight. The comment on the glasses was a semi-sarcastic way of pointing this out: the glasses aren’t actually necessary because he sees quite well without them.
We may or may not be getting hints that his “new” powers are super-senses. Which may have always been present but gone unnoticed because everybody EXCEPT Atlas assumed they were just part of the suite.
Following from Segev’s point:
At what point do we separate really acute but normal abilities from the truly superhuman? Go high enough on the human scale and low enough on the meta scale and it get’s really messy.
I’m not disagreeing with Segev’s 1st paragraph or the idea that Ron could see the shadow of the ball as a result of having excellent, but normal, eyesight.
I’m just expounding on the idea he started in his second paragraph.
Let’s say superheroes are a known thing, but that their powers are genuinely unexplained. We don’t have “oh, he was exposed to radiation” or an easily detectible “Blue Gene” that coincides with powers. Sure, some might be aliens or have supertech or obvious magic. Others might be still obviously superhuman due to their nature (human torch, psychic abilities, flight). The Flash is obviously impossibly fast.
But let’s say some supers are just inexplicably so. We know they’re supers because they do impossible things.
But at what point does speed become “super-speed?” When does strength become “super-strength?” If the Flash entered a race, we’d say it’s unfair because he’s a superhero. But what if somebody’s “power” was just running at superhuman but sub-race car speeds? 100 mph, for example. That’s still pretty clearly superhuman.
What if he can just sprint at superhuman speeds for a few seconds before tiring? Maybe he can do a 1 minute mile. Is that superhuman? It sounds like it, since that’s 4x as fast as any man has yet to run a mile. But at what point do we say “that’s not a superpower; it’s just being really really athletic?”
It’s an interesting question. And if supers existed, it would be a tricky one, because you’d have to answer it for things like sports. Do you let the super-powered join the Olympics? If it’s genetic, chemical, or radioactive or mechanical, you could exclude on those bases, but what if it’s not detectible in that fashion?
Imagine being an X-Men mutant with a “super strength” power that really only made you about half again as strong as you’d normally be. Unless you went into body-building, it may NEVER be detected. There would be normal humans stronger than you. And you might find normal humans who could beat you in body-building and strongman competitions even if you did work out somewhat. Wouldn’t it stink to have the Sentinels coming after you for your detectible X-Gene when you don’t even know you have a power?
Or worse, to find out that you lose your silver medal at the Olympics because they later genetically test you and find out you’re a strong-man mutant? I mean, it’s a SILVER medal. You didn’t even win gold with your unintended cheating!
Actually sports is where it gets easy…for example there already are dozens of different divisions in sports (wrestling weights, various pro series, letter grade car class racing, sport Leagues, etc.) and since we already know that F.I.S.S is a common enough power set to classify it seems like a baby step to set bounds for similar powers for sports leagues/groups such as super speed (bullet time would be a different level/class of speed than running at 100 mph and having the same perception of time and all that).
Anyway it wouldn’t be perfect but it would be do-able and allow for friendly competition which, when you get right down to it, is pretty much the main idea.
Maybe he could… BUT would the senior Powers believe it if they found out that it came from Tyler? Given that we’ve already seen the male Power (dunno whether he’s Ultimate or Sovereign, and don’t really care, ’cause I can think of a better word for him, but it’s not printable) think about running a security check on Tyler he’s unlikely to take seriously anything his real son says. For that matter, Zodon could cause a lot more havoc than he intends: suppose that he uses Tyler’s DNA to get somewhere he shouldn’t, and does something there that is only found out after he leaves. The EDL go looking for the culprit and find a record of the DNA that got said culprit past the scanners. We know it was Zodon using Tyler’s hair, but since Toby is a clone, his DNA is the same as Tyler’s. The idiot Powers have trouble remembering that they have a son other than Toby, so what price them thinking he’s done it? Although, I suppose it’s more likely that they will find it inconceivable that their precious super-son could possibly have done anything wrong, and so they either blame Tyler or think he’s managed to do what Zodon did — use Toby’s DNA to get past the scanners — because they have forgotten just who the real son is.
Really? They’re known not to approve of the Revenant, as a nonpowered individual, doing superhero things – what makes you so sure that’d change when it’s a nonpowered kid?
This sentence make no sense at all.
How could he see it ? what shadow ? if the ball is under a cup then it is occulted from light and have no shadow, is it shroddinger’s shadow ?
Partially translucent cup with a light source behind it? I think he’s convinced that he’s just observant, when it might be a sign of a developing power.
Actually, this would likely be described as “seeing its shadow under the cup,” and could also be a nascent X-ray vision power activating to partially reveal the contents of an opaque container.
Seeing the ball coming would also be a super-sight thing.
However, there’s a fly in this ointment, still: the ball didn’t come out where it should have. Something made it go to Ron rather than where it was supposed to. That wouldn’t be a senses-based power. (If that isn’t a second activity interfering with things; maybe Zodon’s started messing with space-time already around here.)
Given that Toby’s powers are known to bleed into and subvert space-time, that baseball could be him accidentally making things go weird around his brother.
Reminds me of another webcomic: “you know how if you squint just right you can kinda “see” magic?” “No.” “Wait, you can’t?”
The guy thought everyone *could* do what he did, he just had spent more time developing it for analysis purposes, meanwhile his friends assumed he had built some magic seeing tech into his glasses.
Or it could be that Ron completed the list from Power and Glory and acquired a new set of powers. Its entirely possible that this new set of abilities that Ron is exhibiting is the result of that contract being met.
The whole glasses thing confuses me. Did he need special powers to see a baseball appear in the air and hit him, and how did he see the ball inside a cup?
I’m reading the intent of that as he saw and managed to barely react to the baseball with good peripheral vision, his eyesight is above-average but not ‘superpowered’?
To rephrase what Mollyscribbles wrote — the flaw is not with Zodon’s reasoning per se, it’s with his underlying assumption that Tyler has access to any areas beyond his closet.
Also, it’s not really a spoiler, since the statement that Tyler’s security access had been downgraded was made explicitly earlier in the storyline.
I wondered if the carnival successes are trying to hint that Ron can see mass/gravitational distortion — but then why can’t he see Cecil when he’s cloaked?
Needing a vehicle in general is because he actually is an infant if memory serves, with that headband being some sort of anti-grav device to keep his head upright as he has only an infant’s level of muscle development so can’t hold his own head up. So he requires a means to get around and manipulate his environment similar to a handicapped person requiring bionics or a suit of power armor for mobility. Why he has manipulators that appear to be incapable of the fine detail work required for constructing intricate mechanical and electrical devices on the other hand seems more ‘rule of cool’ than anything else, they clearly somehow manage it so it’s possible that they incorporate some kind of micro force field generators that while you can’t see the fields in the comic manage to let him do fine detail work. Of course that does leave the fridge logic of how he built it in the first place when he isn’t even at the physical level of development of Stewie from Family Guy.
I always assume that he’s a para- or quad- plegic, and the cyborg part of him he controls with his mind. It tickles my fancy that such a severely differently-abled person can still be a very successful villain (or hero) from the confines of his rather awesome wheelchair.
fingertips on the claws might fold out into smaller digits as needed, similar to how we see him sometimes use them as ‘lego hands’ without bothering to separate the two main fingers
Apart from The Thing on his head, I Think the chair and manipulators are simple ego stuff. To show he can build a Very advanced vehicule that doubles as a personal ship and even house and Portable lab. The manipulators Are to show that he has very fine control over them, Kinda like Dr. Octopus’. But even better.
Nobody Ever Seems To Take Into Account That Having Such Radically Different DNA From A Regular Human Might Have Some Side Effects. Such As Delayed Growth
There’s also the simple fact that Zodon is (almost certainly) a pardoy of M.O.D.O.K. over at Marvel comics. M.O.D.O.K. is basically a huge floating head with tiny arms and legs growing out of just below where its ears would be and its chin, respectively, so Zodon’s design reflects that to a certain degree. Don’t know if it’s any more complicated than that.
I’m thinking Cecil gets some help fromt he head of the agency, IE Revenant.
“Why’d you help Cecil? What if he gets caught?!?”
“Then it will be a very useful learning experience for him, Tyler.”
“What if he doesn’t get caught?”
“Then it will be a very useful learning experience for the league.”
Man, the hubris on Zordon is AMAZING. He KNOWS this place is run by Tyler’s parents, it features prominently in his schemes. And yet he assumes Tyler can’t just go TELL them they have a security breach.
And even failing that he’s got a room full of superhero kids. All tyler would have to do is organize a “who wants to beat up Zordon” posse to go bring him in. I don’t think ANYONE actually liked him enough to try to stop it.
Zodon somewhat reasonably assumes that Tyler won’t do that, and that his bullying attitude will keep people from interfering. Also, what should be a red flag for his plan instead might be encouraging him: he probably recognizes how Tyler’s parents ignore him. So he should be aware that his DNA may not be the skeleton key he thinks it is…
Here’s an idea: Ron has always had super senses. And he never realized it. He never figured out that others can’t see or hear as well as he does. It’s always been normal to him. Kinda like Skitter over on Drive ( http://www.drivecomic.com )…”You mean you can’t sense gravity waves?”. So when he lost his flashier powers, he never noticed that he’d actually retained the more subtle ones…
Probably not going to happen, but how bad would it be for Tyler’s ego if his parents catch Zodon wandering around using Tyler’s DNA, and they assume Tyler somehow got super-genius powers that included physically transforming him?
Toby: “They already registered him/you as ‘Mental Powers’!”
Tyler: “This whole thing is mental!”
Ah, but he can do something about it. Though, he is somewhat limited with Ron there…
Hey, I bet Cecil is about to make his entrance
So… The glasses carry a small bit of his old eye-based powers?
I think Ron is more saying that he has excellent eye-sight. The comment on the glasses was a semi-sarcastic way of pointing this out: the glasses aren’t actually necessary because he sees quite well without them.
We may or may not be getting hints that his “new” powers are super-senses. Which may have always been present but gone unnoticed because everybody EXCEPT Atlas assumed they were just part of the suite.
Following from Segev’s point:
At what point do we separate really acute but normal abilities from the truly superhuman? Go high enough on the human scale and low enough on the meta scale and it get’s really messy.
Still trying to figure out how you see the shadow of the ball underneath a cup?
I’m not disagreeing with Segev’s 1st paragraph or the idea that Ron could see the shadow of the ball as a result of having excellent, but normal, eyesight.
I’m just expounding on the idea he started in his second paragraph.
Just ask Math over in “Grrl Power”
This is actually a question I’ve oft pondered.
Let’s say superheroes are a known thing, but that their powers are genuinely unexplained. We don’t have “oh, he was exposed to radiation” or an easily detectible “Blue Gene” that coincides with powers. Sure, some might be aliens or have supertech or obvious magic. Others might be still obviously superhuman due to their nature (human torch, psychic abilities, flight). The Flash is obviously impossibly fast.
But let’s say some supers are just inexplicably so. We know they’re supers because they do impossible things.
But at what point does speed become “super-speed?” When does strength become “super-strength?” If the Flash entered a race, we’d say it’s unfair because he’s a superhero. But what if somebody’s “power” was just running at superhuman but sub-race car speeds? 100 mph, for example. That’s still pretty clearly superhuman.
What if he can just sprint at superhuman speeds for a few seconds before tiring? Maybe he can do a 1 minute mile. Is that superhuman? It sounds like it, since that’s 4x as fast as any man has yet to run a mile. But at what point do we say “that’s not a superpower; it’s just being really really athletic?”
It’s an interesting question. And if supers existed, it would be a tricky one, because you’d have to answer it for things like sports. Do you let the super-powered join the Olympics? If it’s genetic, chemical, or radioactive or mechanical, you could exclude on those bases, but what if it’s not detectible in that fashion?
Imagine being an X-Men mutant with a “super strength” power that really only made you about half again as strong as you’d normally be. Unless you went into body-building, it may NEVER be detected. There would be normal humans stronger than you. And you might find normal humans who could beat you in body-building and strongman competitions even if you did work out somewhat. Wouldn’t it stink to have the Sentinels coming after you for your detectible X-Gene when you don’t even know you have a power?
Or worse, to find out that you lose your silver medal at the Olympics because they later genetically test you and find out you’re a strong-man mutant? I mean, it’s a SILVER medal. You didn’t even win gold with your unintended cheating!
Actually sports is where it gets easy…for example there already are dozens of different divisions in sports (wrestling weights, various pro series, letter grade car class racing, sport Leagues, etc.) and since we already know that F.I.S.S is a common enough power set to classify it seems like a baby step to set bounds for similar powers for sports leagues/groups such as super speed (bullet time would be a different level/class of speed than running at 100 mph and having the same perception of time and all that).
Anyway it wouldn’t be perfect but it would be do-able and allow for friendly competition which, when you get right down to it, is pretty much the main idea.
Sadly, a fairly accurate analysis. :-/ Most of the adults in the Powers’ team probably won’t listen to Tyler…
But he can tell Toby.
Maybe he could… BUT would the senior Powers believe it if they found out that it came from Tyler? Given that we’ve already seen the male Power (dunno whether he’s Ultimate or Sovereign, and don’t really care, ’cause I can think of a better word for him, but it’s not printable) think about running a security check on Tyler he’s unlikely to take seriously anything his real son says. For that matter, Zodon could cause a lot more havoc than he intends: suppose that he uses Tyler’s DNA to get somewhere he shouldn’t, and does something there that is only found out after he leaves. The EDL go looking for the culprit and find a record of the DNA that got said culprit past the scanners. We know it was Zodon using Tyler’s hair, but since Toby is a clone, his DNA is the same as Tyler’s. The idiot Powers have trouble remembering that they have a son other than Toby, so what price them thinking he’s done it? Although, I suppose it’s more likely that they will find it inconceivable that their precious super-son could possibly have done anything wrong, and so they either blame Tyler or think he’s managed to do what Zodon did — use Toby’s DNA to get past the scanners — because they have forgotten just who the real son is.
They clearly don’t have the same DNA or Tyler couldn’t be locked out of certain areas that Toby can get into
But they will listen to Moon Shadow.
Really? They’re known not to approve of the Revenant, as a nonpowered individual, doing superhero things – what makes you so sure that’d change when it’s a nonpowered kid?
But are they aware Moon Shadow is nonpowered?
They did not seem to be the last time they met, and there are all those stories fliating about…
“I see its shadow under the cup”…
This sentence make no sense at all.
How could he see it ? what shadow ? if the ball is under a cup then it is occulted from light and have no shadow, is it shroddinger’s shadow ?
Explanation required…
Partially translucent cup with a light source behind it? I think he’s convinced that he’s just observant, when it might be a sign of a developing power.
In other words, he might just be developing the powers that Superman has and his dad lacks, starting with X-ray vision.
No, when the ‘bot was moving the cups around, he was slightly lifting them, Ron was simply able to see where the shadow was
Actually, this would likely be described as “seeing its shadow under the cup,” and could also be a nascent X-ray vision power activating to partially reveal the contents of an opaque container.
Seeing the ball coming would also be a super-sight thing.
However, there’s a fly in this ointment, still: the ball didn’t come out where it should have. Something made it go to Ron rather than where it was supposed to. That wouldn’t be a senses-based power. (If that isn’t a second activity interfering with things; maybe Zodon’s started messing with space-time already around here.)
Given that Toby’s powers are known to bleed into and subvert space-time, that baseball could be him accidentally making things go weird around his brother.
Reminds me of another webcomic: “you know how if you squint just right you can kinda “see” magic?” “No.” “Wait, you can’t?”
The guy thought everyone *could* do what he did, he just had spent more time developing it for analysis purposes, meanwhile his friends assumed he had built some magic seeing tech into his glasses.
Which webcomic is that?! I need to read it omg.
The comic is likely “El Goonish Shive”
The comment would be one of the more recent parts and it has a pretty long run so far.
Or it could be that Ron completed the list from Power and Glory and acquired a new set of powers. Its entirely possible that this new set of abilities that Ron is exhibiting is the result of that contract being met.
The whole glasses thing confuses me. Did he need special powers to see a baseball appear in the air and hit him, and how did he see the ball inside a cup?
I’m reading the intent of that as he saw and managed to barely react to the baseball with good peripheral vision, his eyesight is above-average but not ‘superpowered’?
Anybody else see the flaw in Zodon’s reasoning?
S
P
O
I
L
E
R
?
The places that Zodon wants to sneak into are off-limits to Tyler, and using Tyler’s DNA will only get Zodon CAUGHT!
I think Zodon is assuming that if Tyler lives there, he has to have access to something decent.
To rephrase what Mollyscribbles wrote — the flaw is not with Zodon’s reasoning per se, it’s with his underlying assumption that Tyler has access to any areas beyond his closet.
Also, it’s not really a spoiler, since the statement that Tyler’s security access had been downgraded was made explicitly earlier in the storyline.
He mostly has the same DNA as Toby though, so he might actually get VIP access.
It is canon™ that Toby’s DNA is slightly different from Tyler’s — and presumably, the security system takes this into account.
It occurs to me that Zodon might hack his hologram so that it looks like Tyler, and he has Tyler’s DNA as well.
Then he runs into Necronomik.
N: Who are you?
Z: I’m Tyler, you
SQUAMOUS BLASPHEMY.N: No, your soul smells completely unfamiliar. Who are you really?
(Lovecraftian shenanigans ensue)
I wondered if the carnival successes are trying to hint that Ron can see mass/gravitational distortion — but then why can’t he see Cecil when he’s cloaked?
(Does anyone else follow Drive (drivecomic.com)? I’m thinking of Skitter’s ability, here.)
Has it ever been established anywhere in this comic why Zodon:
1. Has to run around in a mechanical vehicle
2. Why his manipulators of choice are about as delicate as the working end of a steam shovel?
I Think That had Something to Do With A GlaDos Like Love For Science And A Lack Of Victor Von Fog Grade Materials.
No to both points.
At this point, I think some character details are just established as being the way they are, because reasons.
Needing a vehicle in general is because he actually is an infant if memory serves, with that headband being some sort of anti-grav device to keep his head upright as he has only an infant’s level of muscle development so can’t hold his own head up. So he requires a means to get around and manipulate his environment similar to a handicapped person requiring bionics or a suit of power armor for mobility. Why he has manipulators that appear to be incapable of the fine detail work required for constructing intricate mechanical and electrical devices on the other hand seems more ‘rule of cool’ than anything else, they clearly somehow manage it so it’s possible that they incorporate some kind of micro force field generators that while you can’t see the fields in the comic manage to let him do fine detail work. Of course that does leave the fridge logic of how he built it in the first place when he isn’t even at the physical level of development of Stewie from Family Guy.
I don’t think this can be correct — remember, we’ve seen Zodon in an alternate universe, where he is a normally developed child.
HERO thing said 5, IIRC. So not exactly “infant” but still pretty young. And that was a year or two ago comic-time.
I always assume that he’s a para- or quad- plegic, and the cyborg part of him he controls with his mind. It tickles my fancy that such a severely differently-abled person can still be a very successful villain (or hero) from the confines of his rather awesome wheelchair.
fingertips on the claws might fold out into smaller digits as needed, similar to how we see him sometimes use them as ‘lego hands’ without bothering to separate the two main fingers
Apart from The Thing on his head, I Think the chair and manipulators are simple ego stuff. To show he can build a Very advanced vehicule that doubles as a personal ship and even house and Portable lab. The manipulators Are to show that he has very fine control over them, Kinda like Dr. Octopus’. But even better.
Nobody Ever Seems To Take Into Account That Having Such Radically Different DNA From A Regular Human Might Have Some Side Effects. Such As Delayed Growth
There’s also the simple fact that Zodon is (almost certainly) a pardoy of M.O.D.O.K. over at Marvel comics. M.O.D.O.K. is basically a huge floating head with tiny arms and legs growing out of just below where its ears would be and its chin, respectively, so Zodon’s design reflects that to a certain degree. Don’t know if it’s any more complicated than that.
Yes and no. He’s also a rip on DC’s Hector Hammond, who had a similarly enlarged cranium.
should he tell him hes keyed out of the wards on his own home?
nah, funnier if he doesn’t. or at least less directly sad. close enough
As if Tyler doesn’t have enough to worry about, I’m waiting to see how Cecil is going to crash the party.
I’m thinking Cecil gets some help fromt he head of the agency, IE Revenant.
“Why’d you help Cecil? What if he gets caught?!?”
“Then it will be a very useful learning experience for him, Tyler.”
“What if he doesn’t get caught?”
“Then it will be a very useful learning experience for the league.”
Man, the hubris on Zordon is AMAZING. He KNOWS this place is run by Tyler’s parents, it features prominently in his schemes. And yet he assumes Tyler can’t just go TELL them they have a security breach.
And even failing that he’s got a room full of superhero kids. All tyler would have to do is organize a “who wants to beat up Zordon” posse to go bring him in. I don’t think ANYONE actually liked him enough to try to stop it.
Zodon somewhat reasonably assumes that Tyler won’t do that, and that his bullying attitude will keep people from interfering. Also, what should be a red flag for his plan instead might be encouraging him: he probably recognizes how Tyler’s parents ignore him. So he should be aware that his DNA may not be the skeleton key he thinks it is…
Here’s an idea: Ron has always had super senses. And he never realized it. He never figured out that others can’t see or hear as well as he does. It’s always been normal to him. Kinda like Skitter over on Drive ( http://www.drivecomic.com )…”You mean you can’t sense gravity waves?”. So when he lost his flashier powers, he never noticed that he’d actually retained the more subtle ones…