If the Revenant is indeed Zero, then it means that either Tyler told Julie to lie to her teammates or he is deliberately misleading her into thinking the Revenant is a FISS or at least a powerful metahuman.
Granted, Tyler doesn’t have to outright lie to Julie, he could have said something along the lines of “If you think I’m cool, let me introduce you to my mentor; he taught me everything I know.” In that case, Julie would be the one to fill in the false details in her mind (but Tyler should have anticipated that already given her misconception about his powers).
Such duplicity would be a bit out of character for both Tyler and Julie.
Still, Miss Kyle seems to support with the idea, so it can’t be that bad.
For Julie, I’d agree. Especially since she wouldn’t be that good at hiding. But for Tyler, I’m not so sure. He did come up with the lie about Argonaut/Ron getting his powers back. While I don’t think he’d lie outright, I could see him saying exactly what you said.
It’s not as if anyone has lied at any point here. They assume Zero is an FISS, but he didn’t say he was. He simply said that 0 is not his FISS number.
nice. just a few pages ago revenant says tyler’s idea was going to be worth several supervillain’s worth of confiscated equipment. so 71 gets a freeze ray, 73 gets mechanical octopus arms, etc. so everyone gets a schtick.
Or the Revenant is using some old supervillain gear he confiscated to give himself Flying Brick abilities with the intent of training the FISS team in ways to be more adaptable and marketable.
IN the first picture, it’s on the other side. I think the idea in the second one is that it has been covered up by her hair, but it shouldn’t have been.
I feel the need to point out that Mr. Extraordinary does not predate himself.
Feel free to begin arguing over if the wording of the claim is at all relevant.
That was my thought too. I wording is odd. Mr Extraordinary would be a more elegant solution than bringing Revenant in even more. He already has strong ties to Tyler and Cecil, but I can’t see him wanting to shepherd a bunch of adults in how to be respected. I’d sooner believe it’s Ajax using a new look and I don’t like the bringing in a new character who’s THAT famous but we haven’t met. Smacks of a Stu char.
The second Ajax is present, and I’m sure I’m not the only one to think him like any other unneeded reboot. Ajax 1 might be bringin goodies back with him, and doesn’t want to be called ajaz anymore as he felt a little betrayed that the ‘kryptonite’ was terran made.
To me, lines like “if you’ll have me” and “whether I’m allowed to remain” suggest Zero is capable of a level of humility that most metahumans seem to lack. This narrows the field of people he could be pretty dramatically. Forak, 71, Julie and Mr. Extraordinary are the only F.I.S.S.’s I can think of who fit that description, and it can’t be 71 or Julie because they have different body shapes and are also standing right there. Broadening it to non-F.I.S.S.’s, it still only includes PS238 teachers, Paradox, the Revenant, and maybe an extremely well-disguised Tyler.
Of course, plenty of other comics have pulled new characters out of nowhere, but I’ll bet Aaron has something more interesting planned.
The carefully-worded ‘Mr. Extraordinary doesn’t predate himself’ scthick is actually one of the first things that occurred to me.
The second thing that occurred to me was to wonder if Aaron (and our new character) were fans of Code Geass, given that we have someone named Zero coming into a leadership position…
And lastly, simply because of the way his logo is set up, the first thing to come to mind for me was not the numeral 0, but rather ‘Oz’. Given that the titular Oz (the great and powerful) was a complete fraud, achieving his apparent vast powers via trickery, it’s entirely possible that this is the Revenant doing the same, with a sly wink at the ‘audience’.
Look at ‘musclebound’ shots from WW1, they are much less broad about the shoulders. Even Superman from 1939 did not have broad shoulders. I like a wider physiology in chars.
It’s related as Mr Extraordinary (like the early Superman) didn’t have the huge shoulders. He wore normal clothing that wouldn’t fit around the huge shoulders of today’s heroes.
Zero is a bit too articulate to be Forak. In fact, the only character I can recall that was so precise in his wording is Kent Allard (and perhaps The Consultant). Revenant, however, seems too obvious a choice… and going from one sidekick to a whole team of sidekicks doesn’t seem to suit his style. Whoever it is has connections to both Revenant and his info-broker friend, however… The “tokens” will probably be much more of a clue.
What strikes me first is that Zero is not offering to become their leader, but is offering the mantle of “Zero-hood” to whoever becomes their leader. The person currently wearing the costume (assuming there is one) might not be the central part of this; what Tyler told Julie about might have been the “Zero” concept itself.
Second thought that just hit – maybe Zero’s appearance gives no clue as to who it is. What if it’s a hologram like the ones some of the PS238 kids use for above-ground recess? That would make it easy for whoever is chosen as leader to become Zero, literally with the flick of a switch.
Threading from that, What Zero is saying, that the leader whoever it should wind up being, will be an unidentified individual. That way their own ego doesn’t get in the way of actually leading. If a FISS wants to be the leader, he gives up his number to takes the number of Zero. He/she/it subsumes their own personality for the benefit of the whole. Rather than being a way for self aggrandizement.
Did I make any sense?
I fighting pain meds and turkey coma while trying to type.
What you’re saying is: “Zero is a placeholder.” …which is the other arithmetic function of zero. As for it being the Revnant, he specifically states that it is NOT his number in the FISS count; he doesn’t indicate that he in fact has one. And, if it is the Revenant, as ultra-competent as he is, he’s probably able to synthesize having the powers without actually possessing them.
I expect he’s secretly quite tickled that everyone thinks Moonshadow has some form of darkness powers… After all, part of being super-competent in combat is deceiving your opponents…
An idea that I’ve been pondering is that perhaps this is Harold Nelson, AKA Rainmaker, perhaps with an anti-grav belt and force-field armor (provided by Revenant). It would explain why the idea needs Ms. Kyle’s cooperation.
Rainmaker can increase FISS powers (and help defeat opponents), and/or remove or reduce the powers of opponents. He does seem to be intelligent, cooperative, and prosocial enough to lead others, and lacks the ambitious and narcissistic traits of many we’ve seen in the PS238-verse.
The art is definitely goofed up, in that just going back one page, the “84” logo is large enough and low enough that it it isn’t hidden by Julie’s hair.
“zero”, as in zero powers. its revenant. NOT a superhero.
He’s proposing that whoever leads take the title of zero.
He’s going to offer FISS advive, management, publicity,
and maybe a paycheck. I’ll be don’t see that outfit much.
I think it is Revenant. He’s saying he’s not joining the team(“offering my services”). He’s handing them some resources and promising them more, if they want them(“tokens of good faith”), along with giving them a spokesperson/leader(the Zero persona, whether he’s the one who inhabits it or not). At least that’s my understanding.
Honestly it’s a good bit of marketing, with the Zero persona. Everyone essentially thinks FISS are boring and uremarkable. He’s now giving them a leader no one has ever heard of and who doesn’t appear in the field. He’s giving them a mystique. “The shadowy and mysterious leader of the Infinite Vanguard, known as Zero.”
In many font styles, the number Zero is often rendered very very much like the “no” sign, so as to visually remove it from the letter “O”. The main difference from Ø and the “no” sign is a acouple of tabs hanging off the edge, which are conspicuously absent from Zero’s logo. So, yeah.
The bar is only backward with respect to official traffic signs. Unofficially, you can find plenty of usage instances where the bar slants in this direction.
But what I’m focusing on is the circle. Just take it at face value: A “Z” in a circle. Zero… within the shape that has an infinite number of sides.
He says he doesn’t predate Mr Extraordinary, but I thought Mr Extraordinary hid his flight powers from everyone. So, obviously, this is Mr Extraordinary brought forward in time and given a script by the Revenant.
Hmm. If he is a creative zero, one that gives, he could be very powerful. But I don’t like the black – looks like he’s a zero that takes. On the other hand he is giving. Could he be the most powerful zero, one that gives *and* takes? Yet he is not One.
He can create great throughput. That seems to be his gift. Could be what they need. Will watch with interest.
I find myself thinking of “The Princess Bride”… because, after all, no one would be afraid of the Dread Pirate Wesley, yet they will fear and respect the Dread Pirate Roberts.
I imagine the non-FISS Revenant could certainly play the role of Zero long enough to build up the reputation, and then quietly pass along the mantle (and the street cred that goes with it) to anyone else in the group so they can build on his foundation.
Heh… he’s not becoming the leader at all. 🙂 Neither is any other Zero. Look carefully at what he says:
“My number is what I want to give the Infinite Vanguard as its *title of leadership*. Whoever is known as Zero is the *figurehead* of the organization.”
The Zero will have no control, no true authority; he’s just there to give the illusion of centralization and take the Ego-boo out of the equation.
I just had a wacky idea: Principle Cranston. Notice: He didn’t actually claim to be a FISS, he only said that “Zero” wasn’t his number. He’s got experience in administration (The I.F. has plenty of leading members, what they *need* is someone to coordinate and do the paperwork-type fiddly stuff, something that Cranston has done in spades), he knows what it’s like to not be taken seriously when your aim is to just ‘Do Good’, AND his story is known to Tyler, who would want to help Cranston try to get past all the crap he’s been through.
No chance it would be Cranston, he doesn’t speak like that for one and he’s quite chained to the school to even attempt anything else. Plus there’s that whole ‘used mind powers to manipulate the public into voting me president’ deal.
I just had another wacky notion: Maybe . . . “Zero” isn’t anyone. “He” is just a remote drone with a hologram projector, and maybe some manipulators, and Julie has the subvocalization mike and other controls that give him a voice and gestures. The “Oz” logo is a hint; we’ve seen Zodon using a remote drone with a hologram projector; and finally, we’ve just seen a situation where someone in the background (Phlogiston) was giving the team “leader” prompts as to what to say.
I see that Mike above (2015-11-21, 4:02 pm/4:08 pm) was thinking in this direction, but I seem to be the first to suggest that the suit is literally empty.
If this is the case, I assume that Julie will disclose the secret to the rest of the team before the storyline ends; it would be too much work — and generate to much ill will — to pull off this sort of deception alone. And I also assume that in order to really work, everyone on the team is supposed to get a chance to be leader; the whole point is to take the pressure off of Julie.
I like the idea that it’s not a real person but a dummy/hologram/whatever. But I don’t think it’s Julie doing the talking. For one thing, she’s right in the room, and they’d see her. For another, she doesn’t really talk like that. Another reason I pegged the Revenant is that it sounds a lot like how he spoke as Kent Allard–a rather formal speaking salesman.
The speech patterns issue could be solved if the speaker is following a carefully-worded script, perhaps written by Revenant, or by Ms Kyle.
Another idea is that it is in fact Ms. Kyle who is currently providing the voice and movement — we see her briefly in the doorway on the previous page, but then she vanishes. Perhaps behind a curtain in the other room to demonstrate the system.
I just noticed you said “subvocalization mike,” but that would take extreme mental control to avoid blurting out everything you are thinking. And I think you’d still see her using other controls. It seems too complicated when you can have it be someone who isn’t in the room. His eyes or holoprojector could have cameras.
I’m really seeing Mr. Extraordinary, I mean, look at the eyes. They look sad, just like Mr. Extraordinary’s eyes did in the end of the story arc.
I’m guessing Tyler, (sorry, Moon Shadow) helped with the expenses via the Revenant.
That would account for the only known F.I.S.S. that hasn’t been noted in the story yet.
Okay, I’m going for “new costume, old character.” He looks too much like the Revenant.
That he does. Makes me wonder what these tokens are.
he’s not muscular enough to be the Revenant. But I don’t doubt for a second, that the resources being discussed came from the Revenant
Meh. Kent Allard doesn’t look all that muscular, either.
http://ps238.nodwick.com/comic/10122011/
Yeah, I suspect a lot of the bulk on Revenant is actually New-Batman-style body armor.
If the Revenant is indeed Zero, then it means that either Tyler told Julie to lie to her teammates or he is deliberately misleading her into thinking the Revenant is a FISS or at least a powerful metahuman.
Granted, Tyler doesn’t have to outright lie to Julie, he could have said something along the lines of “If you think I’m cool, let me introduce you to my mentor; he taught me everything I know.” In that case, Julie would be the one to fill in the false details in her mind (but Tyler should have anticipated that already given her misconception about his powers).
Such duplicity would be a bit out of character for both Tyler and Julie.
Still, Miss Kyle seems to support with the idea, so it can’t be that bad.
zero flight, zero invulnerability, zero speed, zero strength.
Revenant is Zero
For Julie, I’d agree. Especially since she wouldn’t be that good at hiding. But for Tyler, I’m not so sure. He did come up with the lie about Argonaut/Ron getting his powers back. While I don’t think he’d lie outright, I could see him saying exactly what you said.
It’s not as if anyone has lied at any point here. They assume Zero is an FISS, but he didn’t say he was. He simply said that 0 is not his FISS number.
After all, money IS the greatest superpower…
From Zero to Infinite — that works.
nice. just a few pages ago revenant says tyler’s idea was going to be worth several supervillain’s worth of confiscated equipment. so 71 gets a freeze ray, 73 gets mechanical octopus arms, etc. so everyone gets a schtick.
Or the Revenant is using some old supervillain gear he confiscated to give himself Flying Brick abilities with the intent of training the FISS team in ways to be more adaptable and marketable.
Or he is controlling an android with flying brick powers.
Seem someone was listening to TV God and learn something.
Hey, where’s 84’s logo? It was on her suit on the last page? SOMEBODY IS STEALING NUMBERS!!!!!!!! 😛
IN the first picture, it’s on the other side. I think the idea in the second one is that it has been covered up by her hair, but it shouldn’t have been.
I feel the need to point out that Mr. Extraordinary does not predate himself.
Feel free to begin arguing over if the wording of the claim is at all relevant.
That was my thought too. I wording is odd. Mr Extraordinary would be a more elegant solution than bringing Revenant in even more. He already has strong ties to Tyler and Cecil, but I can’t see him wanting to shepherd a bunch of adults in how to be respected. I’d sooner believe it’s Ajax using a new look and I don’t like the bringing in a new character who’s THAT famous but we haven’t met. Smacks of a Stu char.
Except Ajax is already present, unless I’m mistaken.
The second Ajax is present, and I’m sure I’m not the only one to think him like any other unneeded reboot. Ajax 1 might be bringin goodies back with him, and doesn’t want to be called ajaz anymore as he felt a little betrayed that the ‘kryptonite’ was terran made.
I think you mean Atlas, and this guy is nowhere near bulky enough for that.
Interestingly, the little math problem for my post works out to Zero.
To me, lines like “if you’ll have me” and “whether I’m allowed to remain” suggest Zero is capable of a level of humility that most metahumans seem to lack. This narrows the field of people he could be pretty dramatically. Forak, 71, Julie and Mr. Extraordinary are the only F.I.S.S.’s I can think of who fit that description, and it can’t be 71 or Julie because they have different body shapes and are also standing right there. Broadening it to non-F.I.S.S.’s, it still only includes PS238 teachers, Paradox, the Revenant, and maybe an extremely well-disguised Tyler.
Of course, plenty of other comics have pulled new characters out of nowhere, but I’ll bet Aaron has something more interesting planned.
Doubt on whether he’s allowed to remain could just be that the kicker is that he isn’t a FISS.
It can’t be Forak because he was already in the room too, right? Also, Forak always struck me as immature. I doubt he’s Zero.
The carefully-worded ‘Mr. Extraordinary doesn’t predate himself’ scthick is actually one of the first things that occurred to me.
The second thing that occurred to me was to wonder if Aaron (and our new character) were fans of Code Geass, given that we have someone named Zero coming into a leadership position…
And lastly, simply because of the way his logo is set up, the first thing to come to mind for me was not the numeral 0, but rather ‘Oz’. Given that the titular Oz (the great and powerful) was a complete fraud, achieving his apparent vast powers via trickery, it’s entirely possible that this is the Revenant doing the same, with a sly wink at the ‘audience’.
As interesting and appropriate a choice as Mr Extraordinary would be, isn’t he broader across the shoulders than Zero?
Look at ‘musclebound’ shots from WW1, they are much less broad about the shoulders. Even Superman from 1939 did not have broad shoulders. I like a wider physiology in chars.
Thank you for sharing, but how exactly is that related to the topic of whether Zero and Mr Extraordinary are the same person?
It’s related as Mr Extraordinary (like the early Superman) didn’t have the huge shoulders. He wore normal clothing that wouldn’t fit around the huge shoulders of today’s heroes.
How well known is it that Mr. Extraordinary had flight powers?
It’s apparently well known enough that he’s officially FISS #1.
I already distrust this guy.
Does this make him a ‘Zero to Hero’?
Zero is a bit too articulate to be Forak. In fact, the only character I can recall that was so precise in his wording is Kent Allard (and perhaps The Consultant). Revenant, however, seems too obvious a choice… and going from one sidekick to a whole team of sidekicks doesn’t seem to suit his style. Whoever it is has connections to both Revenant and his info-broker friend, however… The “tokens” will probably be much more of a clue.
What strikes me first is that Zero is not offering to become their leader, but is offering the mantle of “Zero-hood” to whoever becomes their leader. The person currently wearing the costume (assuming there is one) might not be the central part of this; what Tyler told Julie about might have been the “Zero” concept itself.
Second thought that just hit – maybe Zero’s appearance gives no clue as to who it is. What if it’s a hologram like the ones some of the PS238 kids use for above-ground recess? That would make it easy for whoever is chosen as leader to become Zero, literally with the flick of a switch.
Threading from that, What Zero is saying, that the leader whoever it should wind up being, will be an unidentified individual. That way their own ego doesn’t get in the way of actually leading. If a FISS wants to be the leader, he gives up his number to takes the number of Zero. He/she/it subsumes their own personality for the benefit of the whole. Rather than being a way for self aggrandizement.
Did I make any sense?
I fighting pain meds and turkey coma while trying to type.
What you’re saying is: “Zero is a placeholder.” …which is the other arithmetic function of zero. As for it being the Revnant, he specifically states that it is NOT his number in the FISS count; he doesn’t indicate that he in fact has one. And, if it is the Revenant, as ultra-competent as he is, he’s probably able to synthesize having the powers without actually possessing them.
I expect he’s secretly quite tickled that everyone thinks Moonshadow has some form of darkness powers… After all, part of being super-competent in combat is deceiving your opponents…
An idea that I’ve been pondering is that perhaps this is Harold Nelson, AKA Rainmaker, perhaps with an anti-grav belt and force-field armor (provided by Revenant). It would explain why the idea needs Ms. Kyle’s cooperation.
Rainmaker can increase FISS powers (and help defeat opponents), and/or remove or reduce the powers of opponents. He does seem to be intelligent, cooperative, and prosocial enough to lead others, and lacks the ambitious and narcissistic traits of many we’ve seen in the PS238-verse.
Maybe?
The art is definitely goofed up, in that just going back one page, the “84” logo is large enough and low enough that it it isn’t hidden by Julie’s hair.
“zero”, as in zero powers. its revenant. NOT a superhero.
He’s proposing that whoever leads take the title of zero.
He’s going to offer FISS advive, management, publicity,
and maybe a paycheck. I’ll be don’t see that outfit much.
If it’s not the Revenant, it still looks like he designed the costume. Which still suggests “old character, new costume.”
I think it is Revenant. He’s saying he’s not joining the team(“offering my services”). He’s handing them some resources and promising them more, if they want them(“tokens of good faith”), along with giving them a spokesperson/leader(the Zero persona, whether he’s the one who inhabits it or not). At least that’s my understanding.
Honestly it’s a good bit of marketing, with the Zero persona. Everyone essentially thinks FISS are boring and uremarkable. He’s now giving them a leader no one has ever heard of and who doesn’t appear in the field. He’s giving them a mystique. “The shadowy and mysterious leader of the Infinite Vanguard, known as Zero.”
Mr. Zero’s logo looks a lot like “Oz.” If it weren’t backward, I’d think it also had the traffic symbol for “no go”, which would make him “Not Oz.”
On the other hand, Wikipedia calls the traffic symbol a “no” symbol. Assuming that was what was intended, his logo looks like “No Z” – or “nosy”?
In many font styles, the number Zero is often rendered very very much like the “no” sign, so as to visually remove it from the letter “O”. The main difference from Ø and the “no” sign is a acouple of tabs hanging off the edge, which are conspicuously absent from Zero’s logo. So, yeah.
The bar is only backward with respect to official traffic signs. Unofficially, you can find plenty of usage instances where the bar slants in this direction.
But what I’m focusing on is the circle. Just take it at face value: A “Z” in a circle. Zero… within the shape that has an infinite number of sides.
Very nice.
He says he doesn’t predate Mr Extraordinary, but I thought Mr Extraordinary hid his flight powers from everyone. So, obviously, this is Mr Extraordinary brought forward in time and given a script by the Revenant.
The logo looks like a highly stylized 69 or Gg
Is anyone else hoping, despite logic, that this is the same Zero from the Super Powered series by Drew Hayes?
Hmm. If he is a creative zero, one that gives, he could be very powerful. But I don’t like the black – looks like he’s a zero that takes. On the other hand he is giving. Could he be the most powerful zero, one that gives *and* takes? Yet he is not One.
He can create great throughput. That seems to be his gift. Could be what they need. Will watch with interest.
Just a heads up – the date for the page is the wrong year – says 2014. Unless you’re a year behind publishing. Not a judgement. 🙂
Fixed.
I find myself thinking of “The Princess Bride”… because, after all, no one would be afraid of the Dread Pirate Wesley, yet they will fear and respect the Dread Pirate Roberts.
I imagine the non-FISS Revenant could certainly play the role of Zero long enough to build up the reputation, and then quietly pass along the mantle (and the street cred that goes with it) to anyone else in the group so they can build on his foundation.
He never said he was a FISS at all. He just said zero wasn’t his FISS number.
Heh… he’s not becoming the leader at all. 🙂 Neither is any other Zero. Look carefully at what he says:
“My number is what I want to give the Infinite Vanguard as its *title of leadership*. Whoever is known as Zero is the *figurehead* of the organization.”
The Zero will have no control, no true authority; he’s just there to give the illusion of centralization and take the Ego-boo out of the equation.
And to attract all the flack from the Veles of the multiverse…^_^
I just had a wacky idea: Principle Cranston. Notice: He didn’t actually claim to be a FISS, he only said that “Zero” wasn’t his number. He’s got experience in administration (The I.F. has plenty of leading members, what they *need* is someone to coordinate and do the paperwork-type fiddly stuff, something that Cranston has done in spades), he knows what it’s like to not be taken seriously when your aim is to just ‘Do Good’, AND his story is known to Tyler, who would want to help Cranston try to get past all the crap he’s been through.
AND he’s not built like a brick wall.
No chance it would be Cranston, he doesn’t speak like that for one and he’s quite chained to the school to even attempt anything else. Plus there’s that whole ‘used mind powers to manipulate the public into voting me president’ deal.
I just had another wacky notion: Maybe . . . “Zero” isn’t anyone. “He” is just a remote drone with a hologram projector, and maybe some manipulators, and Julie has the subvocalization mike and other controls that give him a voice and gestures. The “Oz” logo is a hint; we’ve seen Zodon using a remote drone with a hologram projector; and finally, we’ve just seen a situation where someone in the background (Phlogiston) was giving the team “leader” prompts as to what to say.
I see that Mike above (2015-11-21, 4:02 pm/4:08 pm) was thinking in this direction, but I seem to be the first to suggest that the suit is literally empty.
If this is the case, I assume that Julie will disclose the secret to the rest of the team before the storyline ends; it would be too much work — and generate to much ill will — to pull off this sort of deception alone. And I also assume that in order to really work, everyone on the team is supposed to get a chance to be leader; the whole point is to take the pressure off of Julie.
Figurehead, indeed.
I like the idea that it’s not a real person but a dummy/hologram/whatever. But I don’t think it’s Julie doing the talking. For one thing, she’s right in the room, and they’d see her. For another, she doesn’t really talk like that. Another reason I pegged the Revenant is that it sounds a lot like how he spoke as Kent Allard–a rather formal speaking salesman.
The speech patterns issue could be solved if the speaker is following a carefully-worded script, perhaps written by Revenant, or by Ms Kyle.
Another idea is that it is in fact Ms. Kyle who is currently providing the voice and movement — we see her briefly in the doorway on the previous page, but then she vanishes. Perhaps behind a curtain in the other room to demonstrate the system.
Heh.
I just noticed you said “subvocalization mike,” but that would take extreme mental control to avoid blurting out everything you are thinking. And I think you’d still see her using other controls. It seems too complicated when you can have it be someone who isn’t in the room. His eyes or holoprojector could have cameras.
I’m really seeing Mr. Extraordinary, I mean, look at the eyes. They look sad, just like Mr. Extraordinary’s eyes did in the end of the story arc.
I’m guessing Tyler, (sorry, Moon Shadow) helped with the expenses via the Revenant.
That would account for the only known F.I.S.S. that hasn’t been noted in the story yet.